Hui Ch’ao Asks about Buddha 

Blue Cliff Record, Case 7
A monk (named Hui Ch’ao) asked Fa Yen,

“Hui Ch’ao asks the teacher: What is Buddha?”

Fa Yen said, “You are Hui Ch’ao.”

Here is another version of this koan:

Guizong Cezhen was a disciple of Fayan. His dharma name was Hui Ch’ao which means “Surpassing Wisdom.”

Guizong’s first Dharma name was “Hui Ch’ao.”

Upon first meeting Fayan, he asked, “Hui Ch’ao inquires of the master, What is Buddha?”

Fayan said, “You are Surpassing Wisdom.”

At these words Guizong entered enlightenment.

Later, Guizong Hui Ch’ao became Fayan’s dharma heir and he was asked: A monk asked Zen master Guizong,

“What is Buddha?”

Guizong said, “When I tell you it becomes something else.”

Reflections
You all know that the words I just read are called in zen practice a koan. However, the word koan used to describe the above question and answer does not really describe what the dialogue between student and master is all about.

Scholars have been trying to find another key word or phrase which better and more adequately describes the dialogue. And what many have settled on is the phrase “encounter discourses.” This is close, and there is an encounter and a discourse. However usually the discourse is a micro-discourse. So maybe we now can call the question and answer encounter an “encounter micro-discourse.” What happens in these discourses? Usually a student and teacher are involved in a question and answer micro-discourse about a question about the dharma. Usually the teacher sees something off base in the student. The teacher sees this in the way or the words used by the student. So the teacher tries to put the student on the right track with a teaching. Now we can perhaps call these encounters “dharmic micro-discourses,” or DMD. But somehow the word koan still sticks, so, alas I’ll continue to use it, as long as you know that what I really mean is such a dharmic micro-discourse. DMD just doesn’t work.

So when working with such koans we would do well to consider, first, what is the intention of the question posed by the student? Second, what problem does the teacher see in the student’s question or understanding of the dharma? And Third, how is the problem solved with the answer given? Finally, what is the specific teaching of the koan? And we know when the problem is solved by the almost ubiquitous coda ending the koan with such words as “the monk was enlightened.”

Now some of you know that over the teaching years of my zen practice I have been creating a koan data base. I presently have 1, 640 koan entries. And since it is a data base I am able to make a search and come us with koans which match the search. In this case I made a search using the match “What is the Buddha?” And now I will regale you with the results of that search.

As I read these koans think in terms of the questions I suggest you consider when working koans.

  1. intention of the question
  2. problem seen by the teacher
  3. resolution of the problem
  4. the teaching of the koan

First of all, koans involving Chao-chou given in no particular order:

A monk asked, “What is the Buddha?”

Chao-chou replied, “The one in the shrine.”

The monk protested, “But isn’t the one in the shrine a clay figure made from mud?”

“Yes, that’s right,” said Chao-chou.

“Then what is the Buddha?” asked the monk.

Chao-chou said, “The one in the shrine.”

***

The monk asked, “What is my self-being?”

Chao-chou said, “Have you had your breakfast?”

The monk replied, “Yes, I have.”

Chao-chou said, “Then wash your bowl.”

All of a sudden the monk was enlightened.

***

A monk asked, “Who is the Buddha?”

Chao-chou fired back, “Who are you?”

Someone asked, “What is the real substance of Buddha?”

Chao-chou said, “What else do you dislike?”

***

A novice who met with Chao-chou praised him, saying, “You are old Buddha.”

Chao-chou said, “You are new Buddha.”

***

A monk asked, “What is Buddha? What are sentient beings?”

Chao-chou said, “Sentient beings are Buddha; Buddha is sentient beings.”

The monk said, “What, on earth, are sentient beings?

Chao-chou said, “Ask, ask.”

***

Someone asked, “It has always been said, ‘The mind as it is, is Buddha.’ But it is not the mind as it is, can it be questioned?”

Chao-chou said, “Forget this ‘mind as it is’ thing for a moment. What are you talking about?”

A monk asked, “What is the real substance of Buddha?”

Chao-chou said, “Buddha’s physical body.”

The monk said, “I did not ask about Buddha’s physical body.”

Chao-chou said, “You just concern yourself with the body.”

***

A monk asked, “The right-in-front-of-the-eyes Buddha—what is it?”

Chao-chou said, “The Buddha statue in the main hall.”

The monk said, “That is a physical Buddha. What is Buddha?”

Chao-chou said, “It is mind.”

The monk said, “If you define it as mind, you limit it. What is Buddha.”

Chao-chou said, “It is no-mind.”

The monk said, “You say ‘mind;’ you say ‘no-mind.’  Am I allowed to choose?”

Chao-chou said, “ ‘Mind’ and ‘no-mind’—it was all your choice. Is there anything you want me to say that will satisfy you?”

***

A monk asked, “Who is it that not even the Buddha can approach?”

Chao-chou said, “It is not the Buddha.”

The monk said, “If one cannot approach him, he is of no use, is he?”

Chao-chou said, “If I say to you ‘It is not the Buddha, it is not the living, it is not anything,’ will you be satisfied then?”

The monk said, “What is it then?”

Chao-chou said, “If it had a name, it would be the Buddha; it would be the living.”

The monk said, “You cannot get away with that.”

Chao-chou said, “We do not see eye to eye, after all.”

***

A monk asked, “When I wish to become a Buddha—what then?”

Chao-chou said, “You have set yourself quite a task, haven’t you?”

The monk said, “Where there is no effort—what then?”

Chao-chou said, “Then you are a Buddha already.”

***

Someone asked, “What is Buddha?”

Chao-chou said, “Are you Buddha?”

***

Someone asked, “What is Buddha?”

Chao-chou said, “What are you.”

***

A monk asked, “What is the true Dharmakaya of the Buddha?”

Chao-chou said, “Is there anything else you don’t like?”

The monk asked, “What is Buddha, and what is all living things?”

Chao-chou said, “All living things are Buddha, Buddha is all living things.”

The monk asked, “Is it not yet clear to me, of those two which is ‘all living things?’”

Chao-chou said, “Ask me.”

***

After the Master had poured the influence of his Tao over the northern land, he was invited to live in Kuan Yin Temple of Chao Chou.

Mounting the dais in the dharma hall, the Master delivered this sermon to the congregation: “I feel as though a clear crystal is held in my hand. When a Mongolian comes before me, a Mongolian appears; when a Chinese man comes before me, a Chinese appears. I hold up a blade of grass to make use of the golden-bodied Buddha, sixteen feet high, and I hold up a golden-bodied Buddha, sixteen feet high, to make use of the blade of grass. The Buddha is distress and distress is the Buddha.

There was a monk present who said, “I wonder whose distress is the Buddha.”

The Master replied, “The Buddha distresses himself for the sake of all other people.”

The monk asked, “How can he get rid of it?”

The Master said, “Why should he get rid of it?”

***

Now, some koans involving other Zen masters:

A monk asked Shoushan, “What is buddha?”

Shoushan said, “A new bride rides a donkey, the mother-in-law leads it.”

***

What is the Buddha?

Mind is the Buddha, while the cessation of conceptual thought is the Way.

***

Yu-ti, the Premier, asked Master Tao-t’ung, “What is Buddha?”

The master called abruptly, “Your Excellency!”

“Yes,” answered the Premier innocently.

Then the master said, “What else do you search for?”

***

Here’s Dogen’s take on the Fayan koan.

[Guizong] Huichao asked Fayan [Wenyi], “What is    Buddha?’

Fayan said, “You are Huichao.”

And Dogen adds the following poem:
Calling on Huichao, Spring on new Year’s Eve,
Huichao turned his head,
no dust on the mirror.
How splendid, Fayan held the function.
Before a word was over,
Buddha changed to a spirit.

Master Echiyo asked Master Hogen Bun-eki:

“What exactly is a buddha?”

Master Hogen said, “Exactly you, Echiyo.”

And now, here are two of my favorite of all Chao-chou koans: Chao-chou preached to the people. He said: “I do not like to hear the word Buddha.”

And then, the great disclaimer: Chao-chou said, “The one word I hate to hear is “’Buddha!’”

A monk (named Hui Ch’ao) asked Fa Yen,

“Hui Ch’ao asks the teacher: What is Buddha?”

Fa Yen said, “You are Hui Ch’ao.”